|
Post by molasses on Apr 24, 2010 22:14:47 GMT -5
Signed onto this board awhile back and have popped in now and then to check things out. Figure it's time to get involved. I started buying Gun Digests new each year as they came out more years ago than I care to admit. I've also hunted down older ones until I'm only a handful away from a full set. That's germane because I'm blaming this whole thing on Layne Simpson's article, back in like the 1987 edition. If I hadn't read that several times over, I wouldn't've even known what those goofy-looking things are... So, I've got a Standard as described in the subject line. Actually, at one time a few years ago I had two of them. The other one was in sorry condition and I eventually let it go. For one thing, the bore and chamber were pitted to the point where fired brass looked rough. Not that the one I still have is any great prize to gaze upon, having some bad areas of external pitting, but at least it doesn't mess up the brass (aside from giving it a beating). One of the used gun price guides said that after Standard went under, some were completed from parts by Numrich. I've formed a tentative theory that the one I kept might be one of those "put together" guns. It has a different style of bolt hold-open than the other had (that one used the flat spring with a button on the end as is still sold as a part by Numrich/GPC while this one has a spring-loaded plunger housing attached to the side of the receiver), the head of the gas piston has a ringed cylindrical shape to it that resembles what's seen in some later gas operated arms (the other was more like an engine valve, with a profile like the bell of a trumpet) and the safety lever is larger and has a knurled extension. I've also read that Standard Arms worked on improving their guns pretty much up to the end, so...I don't know. Hopefully someone here can help in that regard. As mentioned in passing earlier, I've shot both standards I've owned and still take the remaining one out once in a while. I can confirm the report in another thread about ejection being "forceful" and pretty much straight up. Shooting from a covered firing line usually results in brass bouncing from the underside of the roof directly over the bench. However, I'm inclined to start mostly operating it in pump mode in the future, as the "buffer" is just a pair of springs attached to the rear of the bolt and mine look somewhat deformed and splayed towards the sides. It's already past when I normally get to bed. I'll try and get some decent pictures taken and posted tomorrow, including some of the oddities mentioned earlier and of the internals.
|
|
|
Post by molasses on Apr 25, 2010 21:12:48 GMT -5
(Turns out the Layne Simpson article on Standards was in the 1982 edition of Gun Digest, not 1987 as guessed in the previous post.) Took it out to the garage and did the photography out there; I figured that between the sunshine filtered through today's overcast and the lights inside, the lighting would be pretty uniform. I think I might've been mistaken, as things look kind of dim in the pictures. I've set them up in their own album over on Photobucket: s137.photobucket.com/albums/q201/Molasses_photos/Standard%20Model%20G/Since I've got photos of it field stripped, maybe a few notes on the procedure might help someone in the future. This is how I worked it out myself, so if this varies from some manual, that's why. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- It's striker fired, so make sure the chamber is empty and check it a couple more times before pointing it in a safe direction and pulling the trigger. It will not take down unless the firing pin is in the forward (fired) position! The hole right at the rear of the trigger guard accesses the takedown latch; looking inside you can see a piece with a blind hole in it...that's where you want to press; miss or come off the hole and the tool you're using is liable to get stuck and require hard twisting and pulling to get out. Standard made a tool that looks kind of like a cartridge that does this (and other jobs), its' lookalike can be used, or a reasonably large Allen-head screwdriver or other tool of similar shape will do the job. When the latch is depressed, the upper needs to be pushed straight forward, then can go up and the two halves will be separated. Behind the front sight is a dovetail blank. It needs to be driven sideways and out. Underneath it is a screw, remove it. The gas block and tube can now be removed straight forward. There is a disk that covers the open front end of the forend that will probably fall off sometime during this evolution. Careful manipulation of the button on the bottom side of the handle will allow the forend assembly to be moved forward past the end of the operating rod/piston and off, exposing the remainder of the operating rod and spring, along with the action bar that goes back to the bolt. The operating rod is screwed into the front of the action bar and needs to be unscrewed at this point. Careful!!! The operating spring is more than double the length of the rod when it's not compressed and things WILL get exciting if everything isn't kept under control when the last threads come undone.The action bar can now be pushed rearwards and the bar and bolt will be free to lift from the receiver. The bolt can be removed from the bar by just slightly springing the ends of the bar apart enough to clear the transverse pin running through the bolt. I haven't taken mine down any further; at this point there isn't much that can't be inspected or cleaned. Reassembly is the reverse, with the following notes: screwing the operating rod into the action bar seems to be easiest by feeding the spring onto the rod until it's all on the shaft, then slipping the rod's end through the collar hanging off the barrel. Now one hand can be freed up, the action bar brought up to a couple of inches from the collar and the rod manipulated until the end gets into the hole and the threads get started. Later, it pays to get the gas block to line up as well as possible with the blind hole in the barrel that the indexing screw plugs into. Finally, when reassembling the upper and lower halves, the last small fraction of an inch will either require considerable force to overcome the takedown latch, or the latch will need to be pressed in again. Absolute last; when working the action to check whether it's put together right and working again, remember that it won't open unless the safety is in the forward, "Off Safe" position. [edited 4/29/10 to improve accuracy and clarity]
|
|
canuck
Junior Member
Posts: 59
|
Post by canuck on May 1, 2010 0:13:15 GMT -5
Thank you for your post, I'm sure I will find it usefull as I have a Model G in 35 on the way to me as I type! I also have a Model M in 30. The M is a bit of a clumsy beast - nothing like the Rem 14 - but unique and a neat piece of history. Can you tell me about the Standard Rifles booklet in your pic? Nice looking Winchester you have as well, I have a couple '07s and am on the lookout for a decent 1910, but they are hard to find (in good condition) here in Canada.
|
|
|
Post by molasses on May 4, 2010 21:08:00 GMT -5
Hey,
The booklet is a reprint of the 1910 catalog, purchased from Cornell Publications. I believe there's another thread about them and their wares here in the Standard part of the forum. After posting earlier I decided I "needed" the other two catalogs they offer and I didn't see the 1910 one listed on their site (maybe currently out of stock?), although the 1909 and 1912 were listed and I've got them on the way. I can't speak for the other two yet, but the 1910 catalog doesn't have disassembly instructions beyond taking it down into the two halves, although it does show and list the parts all laid out.
I'd like to find a Model M someday to round things out, but the ones I've seen on the auction sites and the like have me discouraged, as everyone seems to think they're worth $$$. That M looks nice and I'm glad it's getting matched up with a G.
The Winchester that slipped into some photos is a Model 1910. Waiting to get a "roundtoit" to post over on that area, too.
|
|
|
Post by molasses on May 14, 2010 7:35:02 GMT -5
Got the additional reprints from Cornell Publications mentioned above and finally found time to study them last evening. The scan, print and binding quality are all of good quality, although one of the originals they're taken from had spots on the cover.
Regarding the contents of the Standard catalogs: the 1909 was an advance one (apparently as in, sent out to drum up business in advance of the product being available) and oddly refers to the autoloading version as the model "H", the 1910 has pages of sales talk about the perceived advantages of the Standard over all the competition and includes some interesting artwork, while the 1912 lacks much of the advertising of the 1910 but has instructions for disassembly and more detail on operating procedures.
I think all the catalogs would be of interest to collectors and students of these arms, and at the price, why not? But for anyone that only has interest in the closest thing to an owner's manual, the 1912 catalog reprint is the one I'd recommend.
|
|
|
Post by keninwood on Jul 3, 2010 3:18:11 GMT -5
I have just acquired a model G pump/semi 35 cal rem from the estate of a deceased collector. No-one knew anything about standard arms co and it was sold to me as a pump action. But I soon figured out it was both. Through the wonder of the net i have learned allot more of this arm and the company and thanks to molases, now know how to strip it down. The gun has a buck horn type sight which looks like a replacement Winchester one. The serial number of mine is 9081 so it may be a later parts gun. But it is stamped manufactured by standard arms co. Any additional info would be much appreciated.
|
|
|
Post by keninwood on Mar 25, 2012 1:19:46 GMT -5
On the 17th March 2012 I had the oportunity to go Himalayan Thar hunting. New Zealand is the only place in the world outside the Himalya's where they can be hunted. I took my model G in .35 cal and shot a thar with it, wonder how many have been shot with a standard arms rifle. A joy to shoot and hit hard one shot kill. Great
|
|
|
Post by fire15vp on Jun 6, 2012 8:26:48 GMT -5
Excellent explaination of the take down process. I currently have 21 of these guns and am maintaing a list of surviving serial numbers by model and calibre. The collection includes one of each calibre. Numrich arms has had a very large inventory of parts but I am not sure that they assembled any. The parts inventory was sold in the teens and if I am not mistaken Numrich Arms did not go into business until the 1950's. Rumor has it that the parts were originally by an individual in Texas. Again rumor has it that there enough parts for about 3500 more guns. Total produced bystandard is around 3700. There are two more serial numbers, one on the upper reciever and one on the lower reciever. I have a theory that the assembled guns have mixed matched numbers. Two of my guns are mismatched. I have seen quite a few guns with gunsmith additions, I believe that your slide release falls into this catagory. Several guns have been noted to have an R or RB in front of the serial number, I believe this to be a collectors mark and most of these guns had some sort of change made by a gunsmith. Someday I hope to publish an article to help clear up some of the myths about this unusual item.
|
|
|
Post by molasses on Mar 19, 2013 16:39:55 GMT -5
Someday I hope to publish an article to help clear up some of the myths about this unusual item. There's been such a dearth of information at all and apparently much of what's out there is incorrect. I'm really looking forward to your article. For purposes of your serial # list, I suggest you contact "Boone's Fine Guns" in Isle, MN and ask if they'll share the info on the half dozen or so they have in one of their second floor display cases. As for mine, it's serial #8948, matching in the tang, underside of the upper receiver and inside of the floorplate locations, no prefix. Caliber .30 Rem. On another note, I haven't been on this forum in quite some time. It's gratifying to see that my attempt to write up the steps of the disassembly procidure has been helpful to folks.
|
|
|
Post by fire15vp on Mar 21, 2013 8:26:16 GMT -5
Thank You for the info I will contact Boone's
|
|
|
Post by huskyjay on Sept 17, 2014 20:34:44 GMT -5
Hi there. My name is Jay. I just inherited a model G in 30 caliber. I was googling it and found your posting about putting together a list of serial numbers. I only see one on this gun and it is behind the trigger guard #510. Anyways hope this helps. JAY
|
|
|
Post by fire15vp on Oct 8, 2014 11:53:50 GMT -5
Thank you I will add it to my list. Another question what is the distance from the muzzle to the front of the front sight? Thanks Ed
|
|
|
Post by fire15vp on Oct 8, 2014 11:59:25 GMT -5
it would also be interesting to see if all of your serial numbers match. All of the standards break down into an upper and lower receivers. Behind the trigger guard is a hole that the combo tool is supposed to be inserted and pushed to trip a latch the upper receiver will then pivot off the lower. there are two serial numbers on the inside. Do you have the combo tool it looks like a 30 calibre Remington bullet with a knurled ring around the bullet portion? If not a large phillips screw driver works well. Thanks Ed
|
|
|
Post by rotarywinguh1h on Dec 1, 2014 14:14:11 GMT -5
I have a Model G and need to find some parts if I can. Hoping I won't have to MAKE them myself. One of my springs on the rear of the bolt action is missing and I'd like to replace it. Probably wouldn't hurt to replace both as the one I have isn't the greatest I've seen. lol
|
|
|
Post by fire15vp on Dec 12, 2014 9:36:00 GMT -5
Have yoy tried the Gun Parts Store (Numrich Arms) they have some parts left Ed
|
|